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Supporting Saudi Students

August 16, 2007

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With the recent influx of Saudi Arabian students sponsored by their government, many American campuses have scrambled to become more attractive to this growing cohort. Very suddenly, says Susan Sutton, associate dean for the Office of International Affairs at Indiana University-Purdue University Indianapolis, “There became a visible Middle Eastern presence when we hadn’t had such a presence in awhile.”

Two years since the Saudi government scholarship program started and thousands of Saudi students at U.S. campuses later, the interest in better supporting the Saudi Arabian student population – and averting any backlash to their presence in large numbers in unexpected places like Missoula, Montana – remains high. “In addition to reaching out to them in a proactive sense, one could easily state that we’ve reached out to the campus as a whole practically,” says Brian Lofink, the liaison for international programs at the University of Montana. “It’s a two-way street.”

Educational Efforts

Not surprisingly, many if not most of the efforts to better serve Saudi students focus on education of all sorts. At Montana, international education staff members reached out to residence life and custodial services personnel to alert them to Muslim pre-prayer washing rituals – with the goal being that neither the janitor nor the freshman from Florida would then be shocked to walk into a dormitory bathroom and see a student washing his feet in a sink.

Colorado State University, which has about 150 Saudi students now, trained more than 700 faculty and staff on Middle Eastern culture, educational systems, and cross-cultural communication, and also sponsored a Middle East Training Workshop series with a U.S. State Department grant, says Mark Hallett, director of international student and scholar services.

At Indiana’s Indianapolis campus, fall-out from an incident in which local police pulled a group of newly arrived Saudi students from a crowd celebrating the Final Four tournament to accuse them of ticket scalping -- "They didn't even know what a ticket scalper was," IUPUI's Sutton says -- gave way to the creation of a video to be used to train police officers about cultural sensitivity. And throughout Indiana, a $13,500 collaborative training grant from NAFSA: Association of International Educators and the State Department has helped foster training in cross-cultural understanding, says Heidi Gregori-Gahan, director of international programs and services at the University of Southern Indiana.

“We were anticipating that with this huge influx into our communities that there might be a backlash,” says Gregori-Gahan, who came up with the idea for the statewide effort to respond to the increase in Saudi students. The grant provided funds for a “Train the Trainers” workshop, in which a small group of staff from about 15 institutions throughout Indiana discussed what can be done to smooth the intersection of Saudi culture and American higher education. “What we were primarily concerned about is where those aspects of culture and/or religion would impact the classroom, the way that people learn,” Gregori-Gahan says – describing the Saudi emphasis on oral argument skills, for instance, as a possible barrier for instructors who might be surprised or otherwise offended by a Saudi student’s steadfastness in speech in the classroom. “Suddenly, when you learn about aspects of the culture, it all makes sense,” Gregori-Gahan says.

Those “trainers” then continued the discussions back at their own colleges, and each participating institution was also eligible for a $200 grant to present a program on Arab culture. Southern Indiana, for instance, developed a program on women in the Middle East, and has taken Saudi students to speak to groups of schoolchildren. "This is maybe the first time these kids have ever met somebody from the Middle East," Gregori-Gahan says. "You see those stereotypes, if there are any, breaking down."

“You can’t help but feel," she says, "that the good effects are rippling throughout the communities.”

The Challenges

But the influx of more than 10,000 Saudi students in a matter of two years, compared to a base of just over 3,000 Saudi students studying in the United States in 2004-5, has also posed its problems -- and not just when it comes to the notoriously tricky territory surrounding visa applications and approvals in a post 9-11 world. Many of the concerns center upon inadequate preparation on the part of a substantial subset of scholarship students (the Saudi cultural mission did not respond to a request for information on eligibility requirements for the scholarship).

In a March roundtable discussion on Saudi students sponsored by Institute of International Education (IIE), educators identified key challenges including “discerning students’ real skill sets and students’ criteria for eligibility for academic programs” and “accommodating for the disconnect between some students’ interests in highly competitive programs and actual skills and credentials,” according to an article in the forthcoming fall 2007 issue of the IIENetworker by Jamal Alsayyed of the University of Arizona’s Office of International Student Programs and Services.

Under the scholarship, students are eligible for a year to 18 months of English language instruction prior to beginning their degree program. However, with many students coming in at very low levels of English proficiency, some aren’t rising to the expectations within their allotted time limit. “We have seven levels [of English language instruction] and we were getting some of the students at two and three,” says Jeff Adams-Davis, director of the English Language Training Institute at the University of North Carolina at Charlotte. “Some of them were getting frustrated and went to technical school or elsewhere.”

“It appears the first influx of students really was never screened academically,” says Jerry Wilcox, director of the international office at the University of Texas at Austin. UT’s Austin campus, Wilcox says, received a relatively small number of Saudi students on the scholarship because it did not offer a guarantee of admission to students who completed the English program. Officials at other institutions, like Arizona State University, had to scramble to come up with a procedure for conditionally admitting students without a Test of English as a Foreign Language score. Alsayyed's IIENetworker article lists other successful practices for admitting Saudi students with ambiguous credentials, including requiring that they first enroll in a community college for a semester or admitting students to less demanding majors while offering them the option to switch at a later date if they succeed academically.

Deborah Healey, director of the English Language Institute at Oregon State University, adds that while low English language proficiency has been a problem with many Saudi Arabian students studying on scholarship at her institution, many of the challenges that surround serving the Saudi students stem from the fact that universities like hers were swamped with, well, tons of undergraduates at once. In just the first academic year of the scholarship program, 2005-6, the balance of Saudi undergraduate and graduate students shifted dramatically, according to IIE: In 2004-5, 52 percent of Saudi students studying in the United States were graduate students. In 2005-6, just 29 percent were. The percentage at the undergraduate level, meanwhile, climbed from 36 to 49 percent in that time, and the proportion of students classified as "other" -- which includes intensive English language learners -- increased from 8 to 22 percent.

“Having a large cohort of undergraduate students meant you have to deal with the same issues as all undergraduates: You know, ‘How do you wake up in the morning?’” Healey says.

“You have to sit there and tell them exactly what they need to do,” says Zohreh Sotoodeh, director of international undergraduate admissions at Arizona State University. Arizona State -- which received 30 inquiries from Saudi students looking to apply in the two days before staff even confirmed the existence of the scholarship program back in fall 2005, and which subsequently received almost 500 applications in three weeks – assigned an adviser just to help Saudi students.

With such a big group of students from one country, says Sotoodeh, “You have to put in more time....You can’t just let them loose.”

Integrating Saudi Students, Academically or Otherwise

But by and large, the recent history of Saudi-U.S. interaction on U.S. campuses is characterized by “broad failures,” says Grant Smith, director of research for the Institute for Research: Middle Eastern Policy, a Washington think tank supportive of increased relations with the Arab world that conducted an online survey this spring of Saudi students in the United States. The results suggested that Saudi students are spending more time with other Saudis than they are with either American students or foreign students from other countries, and many feel they're receiving only "average treatment" from tutors and teaching assistants.

“Some of the reasons that you’d think we’d want these students here in terms of integration, getting to know us, our way of life – they’re not happening,” says Smith.

That’s not to say however that most international educators aren’t keenly aware of the challenges when it comes to academic and social integration, and are actively mindful of the gaps. Many universities, including Oregon State and the University of Montana, offer “bridge” programs in which students enroll in a credit-bearing course while completing their intensive English coursework, in order to ease students’ transitions academically. Culturally and religiously speaking, universities have dedicated spaces for Muslim prayer and worked with dining services to offer Halal food options – marked at Montana with a sticker so that Saudi students can identify permissible food even if their English isn’t up to part just yet.

 

Colleges have also made stabs at stemming social divides. Sutton of IUPUI’s international office remembers one moment at a campus International Festival this year when the Saudi dance performance became a smash hit. “The American students in the crowd…they got into it. The drumming was infections and pretty soon there were other students jumping in and suddenly everyone was dancing. You think, this is one of those moments. This is what our careers are for.”

And it’s been an unusually warm summer in Missoula this year, says Lofink of the University of Montana -- where there’s some anecdotal evidence to suggest that the Saudi students are assimilating quite nicely.

“They’re actually getting to the point where they’re complaining about high temperatures.”

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Comments on Supporting Saudi Students

  • A Call for a Non-PC Balance
  • Posted by Joe Hagy on August 16, 2007 at 12:50pm EDT
  • Public policy should always be a balancing act. Americans are a generous people. Maybe we need to re-evaluate that tendency when it comes to higher education of non-citizens regardless of their country of origin.

    Who really decides who gets student visas to enter American Colleges? Are the visas based on academic ability to succeed in a program? What say in the number and quality of the these visas do the instituions or States have? How many non-resident alien students should the taxpayers of any State be willing to subsidize? Can the State Legislatures even say no they can not come here, or that they should pay actual cost? No matter how much they pay in fees and tuition at a public institution they are subsidized to a large extent. Who monitors the students to assure that academic learning is their actual goal? Who monitors whether they actually stay in the academic program at the institution or go roaming after a week or two. Why should an advisor at Missoula actually understand the attitude that any non-resident student would have about Americans? What is a critical mass of these students at any given institution?

    The current influx of Saudi "students" may be problematic or not, but it does shine a bright light on the gash in the American immigration system called student visas.

  • Response to Joe Hagy
  • Posted by Tim Love on August 16, 2007 at 4:55pm EDT
  • Joe, you are failing to see the bigger picture here. Saudi Arabian students (along with all other international students) coming to US institutions gives our domestic students something they cannot learn in most classrooms: the ability to personally interact with people from cultures different from our own. In an era of increasingly cross-cultural business, political, and environmental interactions, this is an invaluable gift for American students without the means to travel outside of the US. To say that we should not learn to accomodate foreign students and attempt to foster campuses where they (and all other minority groups) are welcomed and supported is shooting ourselves in the foot. An isolationist attitude regarding education helps no one and limits learning for our own students. Even if you (erroneously) criticize America's "generosity", at least you should recognize what's in it for us.

  • Lawbreaking = Sensitivity?
  • Posted by Assistant Professor on August 16, 2007 at 9:30pm EDT
  • "At Indiana’s Indianapolis campus, fall-out from an incident in which local police pulled a group of newly arrived Saudi students from a crowd celebrating the Final Four tournament to accuse them of ticket scalping — “They didn’t even know what a ticket scalper was,” IUPUI’s Sutton says — gave way to the creation of a video to be used to train police officers about cultural sensitivity."

    What? They didn't know what ticket scalping was. That's ok; a minor gaffe in a foreign country - although Saudi Arabia is known for locking people away or destroying property for "minor gaffes", like drinking, non-Muslim praying or carrying the Bible.

    And the cops have to go to 'cultural sensitivity' training? So being culturally unaware is a get out of jail free card? I'll try that next time I get arrested in a foreign country, see how far it gets me.

  • re: Knee-jerk
  • Posted by Joe Hagy on August 17, 2007 at 5:00am EDT
  • I didn't say non-resident alien students should not be allowed in America. I said they should be regulated more carefully. To obtain those benifits that Tim describes takes a careful balance in number and quality of students from abroad. I mean I would shutter (or is that shudder?) to think what would happen it we took just any 10,000 incoming American Freshmen from the 2007 class at random and shipped them off to Saudi Arabia to start their college career. I am absolutely positive that the Saudis and any other country would want to examine carefully the qualifications etc. of each and every one of the student we sent to them. Thus, so should we, but we don't. The college registar (especially those in open admission public institutions) often knows nothing about them or even that they are coming until they walk in the office door.

  • Reply to Tim Love
  • Posted by Rob on August 17, 2007 at 5:00am EDT
  • In the years I spent in higher education, I was a recipient of the "invaluable gift" of interacting with numerous international students. In my experience with internationals, I have encountered a number of problems such as extreme arrogance, anti-American political views, severe inabilities to speak English, and extremely offensive body odor. What I learned from these interactions is quite simple - I'd rather not deal with internationals if I can help it.

    Dealings with internationals were especially problematic in classes that involved group projects. If one member of the group was unable to communicate in English, then the group was essentially short by one member and thus at a competitive disadvantage to groups where all members were able to contribute.
    Moreover, I found that internationals were given extremely privileged treatment, especially more lenient grading when I served as a teaching assistant. Who honestly wants to be in a class where not all students are competing on a level playing field? I certainly don't, and I deeply resented the cases of international privilege I witnessed in academia.

    Additionally, I couldn't help but chuckle at your statement that allowing less internationals "limits learning for our own students." Ask yourself this question: if 10,000 students from Saudi Arabia are admitted to our universities, what happens to the 10,000 American applicants who are denied admission to make way for the Saudis? American universities do NOT simply increase enrollment on the fly and hence, the admission of more foreign students is what is truly limiting learning for our own citizens.

  • Posted by Jennifer on August 19, 2007 at 6:00pm EDT
  • I'm really suprised and saddened by the feedback that comes in response to recent articles involving international students. I would have hoped that those working in higher education would see the VALUE international students bring to our campuses. Instead, it seems that our faculty/staff are perpetuating ideas I thought higher education was supposed to dispell.

  • Sad, But True
  • Posted by Scrawed on August 20, 2007 at 4:15pm EDT
  • This is at least partly in response to Jennifer's and Tim Love's comments.

    There was a time when I would have voted on the "pro" side of this argument - I would have been in support of international students and programs to support them.

    However, I (and many others) have found that the realities fall far short of the promises of international student participation. There are issues with hostility and nationality- and/or ethnic-based clustering by participating international students. Although some may assert that these are natural tendencies in describing the behavior of people abroad ("clustering" and "reaffirmed nationalism"), they are tendencies that reduce the benefits of study abroad. If the group numbers are sufficient, this clustering may even invalidate many or all of the reasons for studying abroad. Can a student really arrive at an understanding of another culture when they spend most or all of their time interacting with their own cultural group? We have already encouraged clustering among Indian, Chinese, and East/SE Asian students by admitting large numbers of these students to certain programs (mostly engineering and business, in that order). What impacts has this had on domestic student populations?

    A few years ago an international Muslim student claimed that he had been physically assaulted by Caucasian racists on the Arizona State campus. These charges were taken very seriously by the university and local law enforcement. Later he admitted that no assault had taken place, that he had fabricated the entire incident. What impact do you suppose this had on racial relations at the university and in the surrounding community?

    Furthermore, the phenomenon of unequal treatment that Rob observes is very real. International students frequently receive passes for behavior that result in expulsion for domestic students. The reasons for this include the potential market effects, the large populations already in attendance and their activism, the "discrepancy in consequences" argument, and the "cultural practices and sensitivities" claim.
    As a consequence, institutionally condoned plagiarism has become a big problem among international students (Ohio University's graduate engineering scandal and the Fuqua cheating scandal were just the tips of the icebergs). It is a HIGHLY RELEVANT FACTOR in why American student numbers are declining in engineering. I have also seen the "group project" issues that Rob mentions firsthand and suggest that the problems implicit in such "cooperative work" are even more severe than he indicates.

    This extends beyond plagiarism issues. In a court DWI and manslaughter case involving two Saudi female national students (again, at Arizona State) bail was set for the primary offender (probably following university pressure) despite repeated claims by the family of the deceased (American citizen) student that she was a flight risk. Bail was paid by the accused student's family, and she was able to flee the country before trial. In such a situation, it is very difficult to assess what if any benefits were incurred by the host population and local students.

    Some possible solutions?

    Reduce international student clustering by country of origin, institution and also by discipline. Admit some more Africans, South Americans, East Europeans, and Central Asians, and far fewer Indian nationals.

    Reduce the ratios of international students to domestic students in programs with high international student participation rates. There is no reason on earth why American graduate engineering programs should be 80%+ international students.

    Remove dual- or multiple-standards of treatment codes. Make sure that the students you have engage in behaviors that adequately reflect the letter of institutional values. If they can't live up to the code of the host institution or the laws of the host country, they really don't belong there in the first place. There is a real problem with "repeat passes" for academic dishonesty among international students.

    There's a real need for a reporting and enforcement organization, because the educational institutions concerned have a very poor record of internally dealing with either discrimination issues or academic dishonesty issues. Currently oversight is mostly carried out by the cooperative efforts of accreditation boards, local newspapers, and students. The institutions themselves at all levels are usually the worst parties with which to raise issues.

  • Sources for news story claims
  • Posted by Scrawed on August 21, 2007 at 9:35pm EDT
  • Thought I should provide some links to the two stories I alluded to earlier:

    On the Kuwaiti international student hit-and-run cases:

    http://www.eastvalleytribune.com/story/58423

    On Nasim's fabrication of anti-Muslim assaults at ASU:

    http://www.jewishworldreview.com/michelle/malkin100501.asp

  • Saudi students
  • Posted by Dr. Jon Mandaville , Professor at Portland State University on August 22, 2007 at 5:15am EDT
  • We've got something over 170 Saudi students this year at Portland State. They're younger and on average less well prepared than in the past for English - but I could say the same for my American students. They're hard-working, anxious to hold on to their fellowships, and enormously curious about the United States. They group together no more or less than our far more numerous Japanese and Chinese students. All foreign students understandably group together for "cultural protection" when they first arrive. American students do the same thing in Europe, let alone in a more culturally challenging country. Saudi students face an America which is highly critical of Saudi culture; it's easy to understand why they'd clump - a few letters here illustrate that well. Few of our working commuter university students can afford a Junior Year Abroad. Saudi and other international students are their next best chance to learn something first hand about the world - and thankfully, they do learn. 170? If we had classrooms to put them in, we'd gladly take more.

  • Re: Saudi Students
  • Posted by Rob on August 22, 2007 at 3:20pm EDT
  • Dr. Mandaville,

    It's truly sad that you have such a double standard for students. If Saudi students are "less well prepared" as you say, why should they be admitted at all? You apparently believe that these students should be admitted over better-qualified students simply because they're from overseas. Are you advocating a sort of "affirmative action" for internationals?
    Perhaps you feel that your American students are undeserving of an education simply because they are American. Sigh.... Sadly your views are all too common in academia...

  • Re: Saudi Students
  • Posted by Judith Amed on August 22, 2007 at 10:55pm EDT
  • I have found all comments fascinating. I am currently researching the Saudi Arabian Schoarlship Health program at the University of Sydney as part of my PhD thesis. I am researching all stakeholders from pre-selection, English and foundation programs, undergraduate and post-graduate entry into our Medical and Health degress. I would like to hear from any who have further challenges or successes that they wish to share.

    I only one day that our global village (and in particular our eductaional one) welcomes everyone and values what each brings, rather than focus on the gaps between us. That's what makes the world an interesting place, that we are all different.

  • International student subsidize American Education
  • Posted by International Advisor on September 4, 2007 at 5:30pm EDT
  • I think it's important to know the facts about how international students subsidize American public colleges and Universities. On Average international students pay 2-3 times the tuition that American students pay. They are not eligible for ANY state or federally funded scholarships or aid. They certainly do not get a free ride from anyone. Additionally, the 10,000 slots taken by Saudi Students helps the public institutions who have FALLING enrollments due to shrinking birthrates and Americans not being able to afford college. The international students pay many of the bills.

    Most importantly American students really need to get to know Saudi and all international students. We don't live in a world that is dominated by the US anymore. We live in a an increasingly multipolar and multicultural world. International students bring that valuable gift to the classroom and the campus.

  • Substantiate these claims, please
  • Posted by Scrawed on September 5, 2007 at 5:40pm EDT
  • To "International Advisor,"

    "I think it’s important to know the facts about how international students subsidize American public colleges and Universities."

    To the best of my knowledge, American colleges and universities are primarily funded by American student tuition, American alumni gifts, managed investments and taxes paid by American citizens. Perhaps you have facts that are in accord with your assertion. What are they?

    "On Average international students pay 2-3 times the tuition that American students pay."

    Again to the best of my knowledge, at worst international students pay out-of-state tuition rates which are applied to non-state-resident American students also. But perhaps you have some evidence that international students pay some special international student fee that raises their tuition to double or triple that of non-state-resident American students. Show us the money.

    "They are not eligible for ANY state or federally funded scholarships or aid. They certainly do not get a free ride from anyone. "

    Actually many international students are eligible for and participate in work-study, RA, and TA positions, which at public universities usually accords them in-state tuition rates. Furthermore, they are often eligible for extensive aid and scholarships from their native countries, and sometimes even receive tuition reimbursement from American employers (trying to fiddle the work-visa system). So I'd say this statement is deeply misleading at worst.

    "Additionally, the 10,000 slots taken by Saudi Students helps the public institutions who have FALLING enrollments due to shrinking birthrates and Americans not being able to afford college. The international students pay many of the bills."

    What you are saying here is that international student participation, then, is helping maintain a price and tuition structure that excludes Americans from institutions of higher learning, and this exclusion aggravates falling domestic enrollments.

    "Most importantly American students really need to get to know Saudi and all international students."

    Do they? Should it come at the expense of other aspects of their educations? Should it come at the expense of some Americans' entire educations? Having done this, are they necessarily better people? Does it make them any more productive? Does it even assure them of a place in their own society? The phrasing of this statement reminds me of the "foreign language crisis" issue and one facetious response that claimed "American students need to know foreign languages - all of them." This flies in the face of current hiring practices (where foreign language fluency rates at the bottom of 'desired skills'). Remember too, proximity does not necessarily breed amity, and understanding does not necessarily promote acceptance.

    "We don’t live in a world that is dominated by the US anymore. We live in a an increasingly multipolar and multicultural world. International students bring that valuable gift to the classroom and the campus."

    Frankly we haven't lived in a world that was dominated by the US for very long - at most not even 70 years yet. Unless there's been some kind of space invasion, we have in fact a shrinking number of cultures as a number of languages and cultures assert cultural, economic and political dominance. I'd agree that this will lead to greater degree of multi-polarity. An issue to consider is to what extent this threatens nations' ability to pursue self-determination. Another issue to consider is the extent to which this will threaten American sovereignty and even the maintenance of rights and laws in this country for its own citizens. Finally, I find that last non-sequitur assertion more than a little cryptic. Perhaps you could be more specific about this "gift" that international students bring us. If you are asserting that the provision and articulation of differing perspectives provides value, I'd concur - to assert that this makes all international students intrinsically more valuable is problematic at best.

  • International Advisor's statements are ridiculous!
  • Posted by Rob on September 22, 2007 at 8:55am EDT
  • I don't know what sort of fantasy land International Advisor lives in, but his/her statements are simply downright false.

    First, international students do not pay more than *all* Americans - they only pay more than Americans who happen to live within the state where the University is located. If an American student in Delaware wishes to attend school in Maryland, for example, they too would pay the same rate as internationals, regardless of the short distance between those two states.

    Second, you claim "they're not getting a free ride from anyone." Yet, if you read the article, it clearly states the Saudis are getting a free ride- from their own government. This is also common for international students from China and India. When I was in graduate school, I knew numerous Chinese students who told me their government was paying their tuition plus giving them a generous living allowance. Many of them were actually suprised when they came to the U.S. and realized that most American students had to work part-time jobs or were going deeply into debt to finance their educations.

    Third, your claim that enrollments are FALLING is one of the most ridiculous things I've read on these forums!! I honestly have never heard of an American university with falling enrollment! I would like to see you provide some examples. Most universities in America are reporting record numbers of applicants as well as record numbers of rejections due to applications outpacing space available. Most state universities, in fact, have *DECLINING* acceptance rates- something that would not be happening if seats were being left unfilled. My own alma mater (a state university) accepts less than 50% of its applicants today - down from 70-80% just 20 years ago.

    Finally, the economic reality is that internationals are actually contributing to the skyrocketing tuition costs at American schools. Think about the law of supply and demand - when there are more people willing to pay a higher price for a service, then the cost of that service increases. Likewise, universities today can get away with charging higher tuition because they know that if some Americans are unable to pay, they can find people from overseas willing to pay. Since many internationals are supported by their home governments, or come from wealthy families, cost is not as much of an issue to them as it is to a struggling middle-class American family. Hence, universities are free to hike tuition and could care less whether some Americans are priced out of the market.

    So, International Advisor, it looks like YOU are the one who needs to learn some facts.

  • Posted by May on September 25, 2007 at 3:00pm EDT
  • At open enrollment public institutions in the U.S., running an institution to generate tuition dollars means "increase enrollments numbers!!!" even if we are setting up students for failure (whether a student is American with a 1.2 high school GPA or a Saudi with no English language ability). This happens all the time and fails the student, the university, and the taxpayer. Perhaps we need to look at a bigger picture (the incentives and goals of admissions offices).
    May I suggest to Scrawed that another HIGHLY RELEVANT FACTOR to the decline in numbers of American students in engineering programs is the lack of preparedness for such students to study engineering. How many middle school (I'm sorry, but it starts there) and high school students are focused on pop culture, celebrity gossip, watching TV, etc, etc, etc rather than on their studies? What does our society tell our youth that they should value knowing or doing??? In short, the academic disciplines in which Americans are underrepresented compared to international students are those that they are NOT PREPARED to study. Another picture to examine.
    Also, universities cannot admit more students from Africa, South America, and East Europe because THEY CANNOT AFFORD TO GET HERE, LET ALONE PAY FOR THEIR EDUCATION. If we admit them and they cannot support themselves.... well, I don't need to explain what happens to them then.

  • Posted by Scrawed on September 25, 2007 at 5:30pm EDT
  • I will suggest to May that "underpreparedness of American students" is a very widely spread and held stereotype - and one that covers a whole national population as opposed to certain members or segments of that population. The reality is that there are American students across the spectrum of ability. Unfortunately even those at the top end of that spectrum are being painted with this stereotype REGARDLESS OF THEIR ATTAINMENTS OR ABILITIES. When you perpetuate this, you're condemning the student with perfect GREs along with the high school dropout.
    The reality is that this is a convenient excuse used to cover the mistreatment and even exclusion of even qualified and capable American students. It's easier to say this than to invite investigation into instructor biases and teaching practices, and less disruptive to say this instead of engaging in a critical examination of work quality issues among certain international students. Remember, one of the accusations made against Thomas Matrka was that he was an inferior student with "sour grapes." Yet in fact he was one of the exceptions to the Ohio University cut-and-paste school of graduate engineering education. Think Ohio is an unusual case? Think again.